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Notburga
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(Date Posted:03/16/2008 13:44:39)

Of course it seems queer, but a character with a Cloisetered advantage has to take a vow to abstain from only one of the deadly sins, and a chastity vow is not compulsory in such case. However, I haven't seen any 7th Sea married monk character. So I wonder if a monk can legally get married in Théah.
Black Jack Rackham
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RE:Can a monk get married in Théah?
(Date Posted:03/17/2008 09:37:07)

A worthy question.  And one I can answer simply (albeit not conclusively).  According to CotP (p.38) "A priest may be male or female, married or unmarried, and of any nationality." (I should note that this refers to the Vatacine Church not Objectionism, CoA, or Ussuran Orthodoxy, which discuss ordination but don't mention anything about marriage).  While that is in relation to who may become a priest (or monk, religious leader, etc.) it seems that marriage is allowed. 

That said, you asked if monks can get married, and my simple answer is, it depends on the religious order he/she joined.  If their rules forbid it, well, there you go.  (By way of example, I point to the KR&C who cannot marry).

Anyway, just my 2.5531475345 cents worth.
Mark

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RE:Can a monk get married in Théah?
(Date Posted:03/18/2008 17:16:56)

Monks and priests are totally different states of faith here.  Monks spend their days (theoretically) sitting in a monestary and contemplating divinity while cpying manuscripts and making wine and doing whatever it is monks do when they are not attending heir prayers or mopping the floors.  Priests go operate a church and serve as the "conduit" between the divinity and the mere mortals. 

While the church proper probably has no rules against monks getting married in Theah, the monestary may but that's going to be an individual issue with each monestary.  And mainly focus on how much surrendering identity and individuality come into play in that particular location. 

However, I see a couple of issues that would need to be addressed:  Does the monestary allow for spousal living quarters?  Would the spouse need to agree to become a monk to stay?  Would the spouse agree to living alone with no income from the monk while they live in the monestary?  Can the monk leave the monestary for most fofthe year and live elsewhere while married? 


Odds are that every monestary has at least a few widowed members and a few that are married but left to the monestary anyhow.  If your monk has permission to run about Theah as a hero and swashbuckle around the world, I would bet the monestary is going to allow a marriage as well. 

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Lord_Nabu
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RE:Can a monk get married in Théah?
(Date Posted:03/22/2008 13:39:09)

 I would say "NO" to that, the entire point of the monstic lifestyle would be leaving conventional life behind, and, in my opinion, require at least the three classic monastic vows (Chastity, poverty and obedience).

Having a wife in a monastary is mostly a problem because it divides the monks' time between his duties to his wife, and those to his service.

The "only abstain from ONE deadly sin" rule, imho runs completly against every point of monasticism in any form. Monasticism is a lifestyle, not a job, and as thus requires total devotion.

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Lord Nabu
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Ian Mackinder
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RE:Can a monk get married in Théah?
(Date Posted:03/26/2008 07:07:16)

  Lord Nabu's assessment makes a lot of sense to me.

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RE:Can a monk get married in Théah?
(Date Posted:03/28/2008 12:00:08)

It should, he's a professional.  (more or less) 

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mostholycerebus
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RE:Can a monk get married in Théah?
(Date Posted:03/29/2008 11:53:06)

I would say yes.  My understanding of the time was that the religious leadership played 'fast and loose' with things such as vows of chastity, etc, as long as you didn't cause a big dustup.  Some priests had multiple or underage wives, engaged in gambling or murder, and were heavily involved in political plotting.  I think a monk with a wife on the side would be small potatoes. 

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To even make an attempt to describe the gallons of thrice-filtered evil required to bring such a horrible monster into being would need to include sound effects of barking dogs, a high school marching band, a plate of escargot and an entire routine of slapstick comedy performed by trained rodeo clowns and some ebola monkeys. Like I always say, you can always use ebola monkeys to help illustrate a point. All of these things would need to be gathered into a big pile and poked with pointy sticks to even begin to describe the kind of evil I'm talking about. That's evil man.

Lord_Nabu
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RE:Can a monk get married in Théah?
(Date Posted:03/29/2008 13:31:51)

 First and foremost, you are confusing the Cleresy and the monastics, there are differences. Sure, a lot of the clerical (priestly) leadership would have the equivalent of morganatic marriages, and yes, Monks having affaires or lovers weren't uncommon (though it did become less so after the reformation). However, having a lover is one thing, having a wife is something else ENTIRELY, as well as being logistically impossible. Monastic life takes up 24 hours a day, and sure, you can get away for a quick shag, but the commitment to an actual wife would be impossible. That is not to say, that it didn't happen, or that it couldn't happen in 7th Sea

Apart from that it's important to note: there is a difference between principle and practice: It is possible for a monk to have some form of Spouse on the side, but it isn't ALLOWED. Which was, I believe, what the original question was aiming at.

Apart from that, a lot of the excesses of the so-called "pornocratic" period ended after the reformation, the council of Trent in the mid 16th century starting an earnest and much needed (Yes, I'm a Lutheran, but even the pope has recently agreed with me on that) reform of the Catholic Church.


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